-0-? I have no data saved to move the cursor, it cant seem to find a format that will allow it to be reloaded.

I had alligator clip to battery, probe on coil. If Im measuring anything with the probe it needs to be gatored to a good ground no?

I could probably get the ht-25 if it works with the 6022be. at a minimum your saying I would need the Ht-25 & 20:1, no?


so as it stands I can safely get some waves from the pcm for the CKPS and Coil driver out together, if this is even worth doing at all, or are we at a stand still without a better scope/ gadgets listed above?

We are looking for the source of this scatter right?

 

Yeah, good idea, I'm beginning to think that bounce is because the 6022 can't handle it.

The CC-650, HT-25 and attenuator all need BNC connectors. The 20:1 is the Hantek stand alone attenuator, or double the capability of you probe, so with the 1008 I can measure up to 8000 volts.

Regardless, you still got good information. The coil scatter seems to even be in the driver, so you can continue to monitor low voltage sensors in the search for the source of the scatter.

 

Yeah, seems like you need to do it live. Once you put the measurement cursor in whatever is chopped off stays chopped off.

Absolutely.

You can gather all the low voltage signals you want with either probe, but the exercise of looking at ignition waveforms was simply to show that the artifact matched up perfectly with the coil and pointed us in the right direction (IMO anyway), But for future information lemme get some coil waveforms with the 1008 to see what kind of voltages we're talking about. Meanwhile, for high voltages in general, I think you can do injector voltages if you want, when I measured mine I was getting about 62 volts (so use the attenuator probe).

Right, I thought our eventual goal was to clean up the CPS signal as it might be the source for generating (benign) 1391s.

 

And towards that end, here's an interesting comment at NAXJA:

https://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1066869

Although he has a coil rail, it appears to be the same type of thing you got.

Got some spare plug/coil wires around? As the only thing left, maybe that's it. But since all 6 impulses are coming through, just change out the coil wire.

What plugs are you using and the gap is good? Again, it would seem to have to be all 6.

Also NM what I said about image quality, it's me and my portable device.

Also2 my waveforms may not be able to help. My COP may be an entirely different waveform.

We need to find somebody with a known good 1999 to play with...

 

Or not, as my drivers are in the PCM too.

 

[QUOTE=Dave51;3584458]And towards that end, here's an interesting comment at NAXJA:



https://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1066869
To that end, there is another guy Im posting with on this forum now with a 2000 or 2001 with the coil packs he says, altho they look like a coil rail to me but, it's throwing a handful of ignition codes incl for #6 cyl. but also primary/ secondary gen fault, loss of crank signal, ...so....yeah a backfiring secondary on a coil can wreak havock. Told him to change the coil with a junkyard one and see what happened.

 

no spare wires around, i could pick up some NGK lol, everything else has been replaced. spark plugs are 2 weeks old, old ones were champion, new ones are champion .35 gap with wire gauge.

 

Yeah, that's a rail.

Is he interested in picking up a Hantek?

I wish we were able to get some good voltage measurements here. I ***think*** the most voltage we would be looking at is 400V so 6022 could probably handle that, but we're getting into the Red Zone and getting kinda iffy. Also, IDK if my coil rail behaves the same way as the 99 coil so my numbers may not be of value.

Regardless, these discussions are fun. Maybe ScannerDanner will join in and offer some insight.

 

There is some logic to it:

The artifact is definitely coil-related; it seems stronger at the CPS; the plug/coil wires have been constant and coincidental with the error code; and as noted, it's the only thing left.

 

I dont routinely replace plug wires, as I dont consider them a wear item, however, in the rare instance there is some problem they can spew out spikes.

An issue can be whether you have matched resistance (and impedance) between plugs and wires, and whether you are running "resistor" plugs, wire resistance etc (should be measured individually)

Long shot, but not much after all you have done

 

In today's version of hemming and hawing I'm going with the above for the areas that you're measuring (coil driver and coil-to-distributor). If you want to try to get waveforms again, try to get 2 cycles so we know we get all the components (and yeah, in measuring the coil voltage we're probably in the Red Zone in re: 6022, but that's what we got to work with).

Anyway, in looking at the information we do have, the intermediate sections of both the driver and the coil have apparent abnormalities-- a little burst in the driver channel and a ton of junk in the coil wire. This is what I believe is also in CPS and would be fixed by a good coil wire.

 

Did re-positioning the coil do anything?

Also, if you want to use the above format, reduce the vertical to get the whole waveform in (and make it black) to see exactly which part of the waveform is escaping.

 

So if it is the initial spike that is leaking and causing the scatter (which will become apparent if you can post the entire waveform using your initial format), and the plugs are not an issue, and whatever the case it's in all 6 cylinders, then maybe it's the wires. If you get NGKs, check their resistance vs. the Accels.

 

OK back on my real computer and can see all the numbers, measurement lines, grids, etc.

Are you using the attenuated probe? I don't think the measurement cursor has anything to do with it, it may be the protection function in the 6022:

although in practice it looks like it's limiting at ~48V.

Anyway, the implication is that the Input Protection with the attenuation probe is 350V.

I see you're dragging the cursor for measurements (dotted line vs. solid) which explains those values. We can also just read off the grid (20V/block).

I guess the good news is that you can measure whatever you want, 6022 has overload protection (easy for me to say).

Looks like you have BNC connectors so the 20:1 attenuator should work.

 

I just add the 20:1 to a channel + one of the probes it came with?