Jeepin'_Aint_EZ

I'm interested in this saga. Keep us posted. And I think you should hang around the forums. We can always use some more humor around these parts.

drewactual

another little nugget about this rig: it came from way up in teh great white north and has the cancer to prove it.... fugly up under there, y'all...

i've never met a collector plate as badly corroded as that one... I ended up sawing through the pipe after the bend, and will weld it back up when I button the rest of it up.

spent more time getting the power steering pump off than all other things combined... seriously.. that bad bear didn't want to come off...

I'm pulling the head with manifolds still attached. so far, it hasn't been much of a challenge- except for that lower bolt into the intake manifold that holds to the pump like it's a brown rocket halfway out the **** of a 104 year old drinken hag.

drewactual

between cylinders 3 and 4 on the old head there is a crack visible with the naked eye and on the marrying side.

the water passages are so clogged on the block and the head that there was little to no flow through the head- i wager that was the work of some stop leak poured in the thing at some point.

we were hydrating with copious amounts of beer prior to and during the removal of the old head and then pulled the intake/exhaust off the head while it was sitting on a table... well... I blame the beer and bad judgement by my bud, but the intake manifold will now have to be replaced... broke the tab loop off, and also the lower front corner of the first runner.... gonna have to wait until tuesday to get that from the junk yard. they're closed up tight for the weekend.

sumbiyatch.

extrashaky

Maybe, but maybe not. If your leak had progressed to the point that hot exhaust gas was escaping into the coolant, it was likely boiling the coolant at that location. When coolant boils, the water in it vaporizes and leaves behind that reddish brown mud that sticks to everything and starts building up. That crap doesn't re-dissolve. What you describe tells me that the problem was there for a while, so again, there's really nothing you or your daughter could have done to avoid this mess.

You will need to flush and flush and flush to get all that mud out of the system. It's not a bad idea to run a flush product through it (something like Prestone flush or Amway laundry detergent) once you get it all back together and flush again. Be sure to pull the hoses and backflush the heater core also.

And you may want to check your thermostat and water pump. I know you just replaced them recently. However, the thermostat is a good place for that crap to build up, and the mud will actually eat a water pump in a matter of a few months because the pump is not getting lubricated properly and is being overworked with that junk running through it.

Regarding the intake manifold, be sure you get the curvy one from a 1999 or later 4.0L. There was a different manifold up to '98, a difference you can easily see by looking at it. In '99 they made a drastic change in the way the air flows through it and refined it further in 2000. So the '99 will work, but a 2000+ is better. Keep in mind you can also get this manifold off some WJs and other Jeeps with the 4.0L from 1999 on.

drewactual

The crud looked to me the work of barr's, which if you don't know certifies the release of an **** whoopin license for the purp who poured it in there.... grrrrr.... the rest of the system is pretty clean except where it butted up against the passages between the cylinders where the gasket isn't ported.

drewactual

so... all is buttoned back up and I'm alsmost ready to turn the key.... I had the airlift on the cooling system and it wasn't drawing a vacuum at all.... and this HISSSING sound!!! WTF?

so... uh... yeah... how I looked right past this I don't know... but... the head that's on there has a provision for a temperature sensor or sender (smaller thread) the OE head didn't.

I'll plug it if anyone happens to know the thread type and size? else, I'll go looking for a temperature sender for another year and plug it with that...

anyone?

drewactual

aye- 1/8" 27NPT.... or autozone part # TU236... they call it a switch for reasons unknown... < in case anyone else finds this while looking..

drewactual

saga complete.... she purrs like it hasn't before. I still don't like the temp runs @ 210... that bothers me.. it has an aluminum 3 core radiator and a 195* 'stat in it, and the oil and coolant should be flowing like never before... I just don't get the 210 thing... but according to the consensus here, that's normal for these things? ..... it's just weird to me...

anyway, ended up using a 3/8 NPT plug from the hardware store w/ a bit of thread tape on the second temperature sensor/sendor port...

I gotta tell y'all, that is the easiest head swap/ upper gasket kit I've ever done. these things are wicked easy to work on...

Appreciate your assists and putting up with me! As threatened prior, I'll be headin out the door now! (unless something else happens to that thing that requires help)

extrashaky

What casting number head did you end up using?

The older XJs had two temperature switches/senders, whereas I believe they did away with the second one in the newer heads when they went to OBDII. Did you buy a head from an older motor?

Congrats!

210° is absolutely 100% normal. That's why they put it at straight up on the temperature gauge, so you can see at a glance whether the temp is correct. This motor and the computer are designed to run at peak efficiency at 210°.

Don't try to fight it. You'll lose. Sometimes people are convinced they can get the engine to run cooler. That way lies madness.

drewactual

It's stamped 0331 but it sho ain't. It's Hella heavier and apparently in several places. I bought it off a fella here, from the buy sell section.

It's comical but you likely had to be there... I'm pouring coolant in and it's coming out just as fast and running down the bell housing. I hooked the airlift to it and tried to draw vacuum... no bueno... killed the compressor and could hear the draw through that little passage. Knew what it was immediately but also knew it wasn't on the other head... so... went and got a sender to put in there, but stopped by hardware store and got a plug, instead. All is well that ends well, right?

About that crack.... I can hang a finger nail on it, it is so pronounced.

It runs a bit stronger now, and there is no miss when starting it while full operating temperature...

The kid is stoked. Last week would have been the first time she would have driven to school on her own... she gets to do that tomorrow. If that is a blessing or curse is yet to be determined...

My diesel produces 615hp and 1287# of twisties... it is not an easy thing to work on, though... these things are exceptionally easy to wrench.... I'm wondering if I were to remove the diesel from my truck and run twin 4.0/4.7's, you know, like a boat, if I'd be better served...

She'll drive this thing another year and a half, and I promised her a new car before booting her out and off to college.... I may keep this thing... I've got a set of 37x12.5s sitting out in the shed that need a home... I'll rip the doors off that xj, lift her up, and see how she likes the trails when the kids gone... it seems like a good toy to play with.

drewactual

Oh... about the 210... I live at sea level, which means water boils at 212*, which is mighty close. If the system is open anywhere, which it ain't supposed to be but shizen has been known to happen, it'll boil and with little to no warning..

The cap is 16#... that should push the boiling point to 252*, which makes this a moot point, so long as the system remains closed and under pressure. But that is the thing... if it opens, there won't be time to react before it boils... I know this for fact.... I didn't have the return hose on tight enough when I first fired her up... I let her warm up, and while standing right over it noticed it was pushing off right before she blew... she blew like old faithful... I had a split second to step back or I'd be looking at this phone screen through a melted face instead...

extrashaky

If it has 0331 cast into it, it's a 0331 head. The number refers to the configuration of the ports. The TUPY 0331 and all the aftermarket 0331 heads are thicker and heavier than the original casting 0331, but the size and shape of the ports will be the same. It's just odd that it had a hole for the second sensor. Maybe one of the other vehicles that used the 0331 had a use for it. Or maybe they included it for people who want to run a second temp gauge.

Regarding the boiling point, you're forgetting that if you're running a 50/50 mix, you're getting a 10° to 12° bump in boiling point unpressurized.

And even if you have a leak, there's usually going to be some pressure in the system to raise the boiling point further. To lower the boiling point down to 223° or so, you'd have to have a hose blow off or something, in which case it would boil even if your normal running temp were 185° like the old cars.

My Subaru runs at a coolant temp of 190°, but I monitor oil temp also and have seen it go above 230° when I really pushed it. If the cooling system has a catastrophic failure, the coolant temp is going to skyrocket instantly despite running 20° cooler than my XJ.

My water pump in the XJ let go catastrophically once and was spewing coolant everywhere, yet it got me the last few miles home without overheating. All this is to say, don't worry about it.

drewactual

I thought the NOAT's boiled under water? But, you're right as rain either way.... ain't no use worrying about it unless it happens.. we do what we can to keep em straight, but in the end it's the gods of mud and tar that make these decisions, no?

drewactual

well, she got hot again... kid was taking herself and her friend to dinner Saturday night... came back not ten minutes after she left and said "it went all the way up"...

between quarters of my game I went out and checked oil- no coolant, went to check coolant, and there was none...

not a drop...

this moring I topped if off with a garden hose and moved it back to the shop under it's own power. didn't seem to be running strange at all.

popped the hood with the engine running... noticed my toes were getting a shower- flip flops, y'all...

the lower hose had ruptured. right where it clamps to the w/p. "you've gotta be kidding me" I thought... "if this thing cracked another head because of a ruptured hose RIGHT AFTER I JUST SWAPPED HEADS, I wasn't going to be too happy about it". So...

Being in a general state of pissedoffedness, I finally went all in on this thing... I'm way past the point of finacnial viability with it anyway- I've dumped WAY more in it than it's worth, and a bit over half what I payed for it.

Restore and Restore Plus. < awesome stuff, y'all... cooling system as clean as new (and it needed it after seeing the innards of that lower hose, which was no doubt stock). I ganked the wire out of the old one and put it in the new one. you know- to hurt myself properly... that's what this friggin' thing is all about, right?

new thermostat. new cap... broke out the airlift and vice-gripped the puke bottle lead. took it up to -20psi vacuum. flipped the valve over, and it dropped- slowly, but dropped. did it again... this time after vice-gripping both heater core hoses. still, it dropped. it's right about now I decide I'm going to swap 'stats.

I killed the compressor and pulled the chuck off the airlift- and there it was- a whistle... a houling ear piercing whistle I couldn't hear with the compressor running... since my ears took a liking to this noise like fingernails on chalkboards, I leaned in- head cocked- and found my source... it was the 'stat neck. it wasn't sealing.

so... I don't know about y'all, but I despise gaskets for waternecks, or pumps for that matter... you know what works? permatex... the copper stuff. after cleaning the block and the waterneck, I laid a bead in the 'stat indention. then a nice layer on both the block and the waterneck itself... waited about ten minutes and put them together...

fired up the airlift and drew 25psi of vacuum in a matter of seconds... went ahead and used that vacuum to my advantage and dumped a gallon of 50/50 in it. drew another 25psi of vacuum, did it again.. drew the last 25psi of vacuum, and walked away after pulling the air chuck off and killing the compressor... no noise.... that's good, no?

it held that vacuum for about half an hour w/o dropping even a little. now, i'm satisfied my cooling system is closed, and can account for the head and head gasket at least on a cold engine.

i checked torque on head bolts in that half hour... still holding 110#- every one of them.

v/c's back on, coolant filled, new 16# cap on- fired her up... ran her to about 3500 RPM in second gear w/ a/c kicking around the neighborhood... and it tipped over 210- almost to the second mark... pulled back in...

knew what it was as soon as i popped teh hood... the friggin' cap...

pulled cap off, took a shower and doused the engine pretty good.. shoved the airlift onto a now hot engine- 25psi of vaccum in a few seconds, and it held while me and that cap got acquainted... we got REAL acquainted me and that cap.

the warm engine held 25psi of vacuum until i pulled the airlift off... I used the vacuum to refill the system... three steps forward, two steps back, right? we ought to call this the XJ waltz...

so... mr. cap (or it may be feminine, which makes greater sense as they are BIYATCHES)... the friggin' little tangs on the cap disallow a good seat on the filler neck. a little crunching of those, and guess what? I NOW have a SEALED (truly sealed) cooling system.

and here is something- it never ran above 210... it ALMOST touched it once, but didn't- and after half an hour of idling w/ a/c blaring.... it likes to run halfway between 210 and the tick below it, which I wager is around 195...

i ran it hard.... I took it to 4kRPM/second gear for a solid two minutes, and came to a stop... it didn't break 210 but it came close, and dropped back down between 210 and the tick below it. drove it pretty hard for an hour or so- never broke 210, and on way back while driving it reasonable, it dropped down to halfway between 210 and the tick below it again...

so...

good cleaning using restore and restore plus (if anyone goes this route, be careful... there is nothing better to clean cooling systems with especially NOAT systems, but you can do some serious damage if you don't follow the instructions to the T)...

good stat that does what good stats should do- open fully at 195- and whallah...

good cap that does what good caps are supposed to do- and a good seal on the waterneck... (no steaming- the only way you'll know.. hover cold metal with shiny surface over it to see if it is sealed right after you kill warm engine)...

good seal on waterneck.

I've finally achieved a truly closed cooling system.

POOF.... an XJ THAT RUNS AT ITS STATS RATING... whodathunkit?

Jeepin'_Aint_EZ

Your posts are most entertaining! I keep coming back for a good little chuckle. Congrats on your sealed cooling system!