budwormy

Well, after three weeks of waiting on the new PCM it came today. Still won't start. Had a good buddy over here and he's convinced that there is air in the fuel lines. It is sputtering like crazy like it is getting ready to start. When he took off the vac line and the return line from the regulator he had me listen and you could here it gurgling. Also, when ever you stop engaging the starter you can here air being pulled in a the main air hose that goes to the throttle body. He is an older dude than me and he's really sharp and has worked on cars all his life and he's convinced the whole problem is the fuel lines are pulling in air. Kinda letdown bc i was convinced she was gonna fire up today. ANy insight would be wonderful.

doublechaz

Fuel injected systems pressurize the lines from the tank forward. The only way to have air in the lines would be if there is a problem at the pump that lets it pull in air with the fuel. The pickup cracked or oriented wrong, that kind of thing.

budwormy

Could it have been the rubber seal got folded over when I put the new fuel pump in? It actually started started right after I put the new fuel pump in and hadn't done that before and hasn't since.

lawsoncl

Wow 63 posts in, and still no joy for ya.

Recheck the basics - fuel, spark, compression all timed correctly. Did you ever buy that fuel pressure gauge? What is the fuel pressure WHILE cranking? Are the injectors getting +12volts to them, as the computer controls the ground side. Are they actually firing?. Use a noid light or a good meter than can pickup the short pulses. Or if you have an extra injector, plug that in and hold it in your hand and see if you hear or feel it clicking. You said you have spark, but is it a nice blue spark? Did you touch the distributor at all, and possibly get it out of time? You said you tested the TPS sensor?

1990

If you turn the key to the run position the fuel pump will pressure up the fuel rail, check the fuel pressure then and when you try to start it. It should be around 36 to 39 psi. If that is good your problem is somewhere else. Also have you looked at the spark plugs if they are wet you are getting to much fuel. Many years ago when I was young in automotive tech school, we were away told to pull the plugs first and check for spark and condition of the plugs (wet or dry). I am also interested if you did anything with the distributor, and have you checked the timing. Good luck and don't give up.

budwormy

I'm gonna get a fuel pressure tester ASAP. I have taken apart the distributor (but not pulled it out) and cleaned the contacts. The pulse ring was rusted and I sanded off the rust with 800 grit sandpaper. The contacts look good and the plugs are firing (but maybe not firing strong enough?) When I tried to start it yesterday, it was sounding like it was milliseconds away from firing up. I mean it was RIGHT there. You could here it fire a couple of times and then just not catch. We heard this loud sucking sound like air being pulled in to the air filter assembly around where the main hose that goes to the throttle body connects with the hose clamp. That sound has got to be related. Maybe the IAC has failed???? Anyway, I'm tired of throwing parts at it, so I think maybe I should get a cheap spark tester from Auto Zone and a fuel pressure tester and rule those out immediately. I've heard o2 sensors can cause similar issues that I'm having as well. Also, I'm gonna get an analog meter so I can check the CAM sensor. Need to figure out what parts are most likely to fail from the flooding incident. It sat in water for over a day before the flood receded. Water was all the way up to the Jeep emblem on the front of the hood. That being said, and I'm a novice mechanic at best, it just feels like it's something simple at this point. I've put all kinds of time and energy into going over everything possible in the ignition system and electrical system in general. All my grounds are giving me .003 Ohms or less when I check them, too. And you guys are the only hope I have and I can't put into the English language how much I appreciate the pointers I've received, so THANKS! This is frustrating, but at the same time I've learned alot of interesting things I never would have if not for this situation. I'm also not one to give up...

budwormy

I need to fix the MAP sensor vac line, too. It broke at the throttle body. That could have something to do with it. The MAP sensor is new, but the vac line is currently disconnected. It's also cold as a witches teet here in the High Country right now. If anyone knows the most idiot proof way to do that, please indulge me...

Morat

Does this mean that the coolant temp sensor for the ECU is reading something like -40 degrees? I haven't touched a Renix Jeep but that sounds like a recipe for flooding on cold-start.

lawsoncl

I've heard the claim that the ECU won't fire the injectors unless it sees some vacuum. I don't know if that's true, but I'd certainly get that hooked up. The O2 sensor should be an issue on a cold start.

Some auto stores will loan out fuel pressure testers. Or rent them for $5.

doublechaz

If the MAP problem isn't as lawson says, then it will certainly massively over fuel because "no vacuum" from the sensor will make the ECU think "ALL of the fuel". It would make sense for the ECU to declare to itself that no MAP reading is a fault and refuse to fuel, but I would hope for a code in that case. But I can't say if it would code with a Renix. Most of my wrenching is on OBDII.

Humans built that thing, so you can figure it out and fix it.

1990

Cruiser54 has the repair for the MAP sensor line on his website http://www.cruiser54.com/. Also I would look into the sensors the ECU looks at in open loop as in starting up, before going into closed loop the ECU only looks a few sensors. Research Cruiser54's website while it is cold outside, study up and stay warm. I know when my MAP sensor went bad it was a hell of a time to get it to start. Good Luck we are here for you.

budwormy

Well, I just noticed a leak at the tank side of the filter and fixed that. Capped off the EVAP hose at the tank and plugged the cold air intake from the canister. I could smell starter fluid back at the tank after i tried to crank it. That could have only come from the return line which is pretty much telling me the fuel is going right through the regulator. Right? Need to replace that. One of my friends came over and tried to help me start it and said he thought that was the problem, too. The saga continues...If it doesn't start by the weekend I'm heading down the mountain for the rest of the winter and may have to pick this up in the spring. D'OH!!!

doublechaz

Normally some fuel will go through the regulator back to the tank. It regulates by sending back what isn't needed. If it sends back too much or all of it, then you will have low or no pressure in the rail. Low enough pressure and it won't start.

lawsoncl

Meaning borrow a pressure tester and verify good pressure while cranking..

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