Really need help
01-06-2018, 03:45 PM
#17
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I'm running Bosch o2 sensors, I also unplugged both one at a time during this process with no change at all, I could.be wrong but I'm almost positive the o2 sensors aren't the problem, I've exhaust every other option at this point I'm down to my pcm went out or my harness is bad, going to pick up a test pcm and see if my issues go away with it
01-06-2018, 05:20 PM
#18
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I don't have experience but I've always read that Bosch O2's are crap in a Jeep. I replaced mine with NTK to be safe and no problems there. Not saying it's your problem but very well could be.
Also the TPS should be tested with an analog meter for accurate results. And if the TPS is bad I would think it could change the fuel trim rich thinking that the throttle is open more than it actually is.
Also the TPS should be tested with an analog meter for accurate results. And if the TPS is bad I would think it could change the fuel trim rich thinking that the throttle is open more than it actually is.
01-06-2018, 06:33 PM
#19
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I am leaning toward O2 sensors as well, unless you have a broken wire in that circuit
01-06-2018, 06:56 PM
#20
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I just put a new tps in it to take care of that issue, I'll throw the old o2 sensors back in and see if it goes back to idling fine and cutting out at higher rpms, I guess it will at least give me something to go off of, the can codes are just throwing me for a loop, the one day it was running I did have a new muffler installed at a shop, I highly doubt them welding it in and being able tondrive it for hours after then the pcm freaking out would have anything to do with that but I guess I've seen weirder things happen
01-06-2018, 07:43 PM
#21
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If you suspect the O2's, or want to isolate them, you can just disconnect them. The ECU will run with a factory preset tune. It runs around 10 AFR. I found out because I had a wideband O2 to monitor. Gas mileage won't be pretty but it's a safe tune.
I botched an O2 wiring job once and crossed the wires. It ran MAXIMUM rich at 7AFR and the only noticeables were it would puff black smoke out the back under hard acceleration (looked like a diesel) and under rapid deceleration from high engine RPM's it would sometimes back fire. And the gas mileage sucked. You couldn't possibly have worse than what I did by having max voltage on the signal wire to the ECU so I doubt you have an O2 problem.
However... running maximum rich can damage injectors and cause them to just stick open, which would bleed fuel pressure. But if your fuel pressure is staying where it should with the new pump that isn't the issue.
The TCU mounts by your throttle pedal. I don't know where the harness for it is, but I want to say it mounts by the back of the engine. You should be able to count the wires and check the colors and find it by the back of the engine. I want to say it's a gray harness, but I am not sure. If you nicked that with the flex plate while you were installing the engine... that could cause these problems. It sounds like damaged wiring to me. If it ran fine before the engine swap, then something got damaged or wasn't reinstalled properly most likely. You didn't forget to ground that strap from the top of the firewall to a head stud did you? That's where it's supposed to ground. Don't use the intake manifold. It's a piece of aluminum separated from the engine by a gasket. You need to make sure that ground is on the engine, somewhere. I want to say I had some of your codes when I built my first engine and later on I realized I never reattached that ground myself. It's a 15mm bolt, and the OEM setup is a braided strap that tends to oxidize.
Your TPS reading doesn't sound good. To test it you can connect paper clips into the back of the harness while it's plugged in and hook up a voltmeter to test it with the key in the run position. As you turn the throttle the voltmeter should show a steady change in voltage from 1 to 5 (or 5 to 1, I forget). If it jumps around or has dead spots... that's a problem. How are you reading the percentages? If you're using an OBD scanner, those guys refresh periodically as I recall and you might want to check it moving very slow to confirm.
Also, I just replaced a semi-faulty Crank Position Sensor and in my readings and searchings it said that a faulty CPS can give No Bus messages, but when it's doing that you usually can't effectively use an OBD scanner. It's because it has a small short in it when it should be infinite resistance until the engine is moving.
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/x...ensor-1167378/
Here on Redneck Garage they talk about how a shorted sensor can cause the issue as well and they go through the process of fixing it:
I botched an O2 wiring job once and crossed the wires. It ran MAXIMUM rich at 7AFR and the only noticeables were it would puff black smoke out the back under hard acceleration (looked like a diesel) and under rapid deceleration from high engine RPM's it would sometimes back fire. And the gas mileage sucked. You couldn't possibly have worse than what I did by having max voltage on the signal wire to the ECU so I doubt you have an O2 problem.
However... running maximum rich can damage injectors and cause them to just stick open, which would bleed fuel pressure. But if your fuel pressure is staying where it should with the new pump that isn't the issue.
The TCU mounts by your throttle pedal. I don't know where the harness for it is, but I want to say it mounts by the back of the engine. You should be able to count the wires and check the colors and find it by the back of the engine. I want to say it's a gray harness, but I am not sure. If you nicked that with the flex plate while you were installing the engine... that could cause these problems. It sounds like damaged wiring to me. If it ran fine before the engine swap, then something got damaged or wasn't reinstalled properly most likely. You didn't forget to ground that strap from the top of the firewall to a head stud did you? That's where it's supposed to ground. Don't use the intake manifold. It's a piece of aluminum separated from the engine by a gasket. You need to make sure that ground is on the engine, somewhere. I want to say I had some of your codes when I built my first engine and later on I realized I never reattached that ground myself. It's a 15mm bolt, and the OEM setup is a braided strap that tends to oxidize.
Your TPS reading doesn't sound good. To test it you can connect paper clips into the back of the harness while it's plugged in and hook up a voltmeter to test it with the key in the run position. As you turn the throttle the voltmeter should show a steady change in voltage from 1 to 5 (or 5 to 1, I forget). If it jumps around or has dead spots... that's a problem. How are you reading the percentages? If you're using an OBD scanner, those guys refresh periodically as I recall and you might want to check it moving very slow to confirm.
Also, I just replaced a semi-faulty Crank Position Sensor and in my readings and searchings it said that a faulty CPS can give No Bus messages, but when it's doing that you usually can't effectively use an OBD scanner. It's because it has a small short in it when it should be infinite resistance until the engine is moving.
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/x...ensor-1167378/
Here on Redneck Garage they talk about how a shorted sensor can cause the issue as well and they go through the process of fixing it:
Last edited by CoffeeCommando; 01-06-2018 at 08:01 PM.
01-06-2018, 07:50 PM
#22
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If you suspect the O2's, or want to isolate them, you can just disconnect them. The ECU will run with a factory preset tune. It runs around 10 AFR. I found out because I had a wideband O2 to monitor. Gas mileage won't be pretty but it's a safe tune.
I botched an O2 wiring job once and crossed the wires. It ran MAXIMUM rich at 7AFR and the only noticeables were it would puff black smoke out the back under hard acceleration (looked like a diesel) and under rapid deceleration from high engine RPM's it would sometimes back fire. And the gas mileage sucked. You couldn't possibly have worse than what I did by having max voltage on the signal wire to the ECU so I doubt you have an O2 problem.
However... running maximum rich can damage injectors and cause them to just stick open, which would bleed fuel pressure. But if your fuel pressure is staying where it should with the new pump that isn't the issue.
The TCU mounts by your throttle pedal. I don't know where the harness for it is, but I want to say it mounts by the back of the engine. You should be able to count the wires and check the colors and find it by the back of the engine. I want to say it's a gray harness, but I am not sure. If you nicked that with the flex plate while you were installing the engine... that could cause these problems. It sounds like damaged wiring to me. If it ran fine before the engine swap, then something got damaged or wasn't reinstalled properly most likely. You didn't forget to ground that strap from the top of the firewall to a head stud did you? That's where it's supposed to ground. Don't use the intake manifold. It's a piece of aluminum separated from the engine by a gasket. You need to make sure that ground is on the engine, somewhere. I want to say I had some of your codes when I built my first engine and later on I realized I never reattached that ground myself. It's a 15mm bolt, and the OEM setup is a braided strap that tends to oxidize.
I botched an O2 wiring job once and crossed the wires. It ran MAXIMUM rich at 7AFR and the only noticeables were it would puff black smoke out the back under hard acceleration (looked like a diesel) and under rapid deceleration from high engine RPM's it would sometimes back fire. And the gas mileage sucked. You couldn't possibly have worse than what I did by having max voltage on the signal wire to the ECU so I doubt you have an O2 problem.
However... running maximum rich can damage injectors and cause them to just stick open, which would bleed fuel pressure. But if your fuel pressure is staying where it should with the new pump that isn't the issue.
The TCU mounts by your throttle pedal. I don't know where the harness for it is, but I want to say it mounts by the back of the engine. You should be able to count the wires and check the colors and find it by the back of the engine. I want to say it's a gray harness, but I am not sure. If you nicked that with the flex plate while you were installing the engine... that could cause these problems. It sounds like damaged wiring to me. If it ran fine before the engine swap, then something got damaged or wasn't reinstalled properly most likely. You didn't forget to ground that strap from the top of the firewall to a head stud did you? That's where it's supposed to ground. Don't use the intake manifold. It's a piece of aluminum separated from the engine by a gasket. You need to make sure that ground is on the engine, somewhere. I want to say I had some of your codes when I built my first engine and later on I realized I never reattached that ground myself. It's a 15mm bolt, and the OEM setup is a braided strap that tends to oxidize.
01-06-2018, 08:10 PM
#23
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I've u plugged both o2 sensors and reset pcm with no results, as well as put the old one back in to see if it would revert back to the rough higher rpms, still nothing, the grounding strap is connected, I swapped to rap head bolts and a titan engines performance head when I build it, they added a bolt on the driver rear for the strap to bolt up to I thought the continuity was an issue since it would have to go through the head gasket and added a grounding strap from that bolt to the engine block side didn't change anything so I removed it for fear it was causing interference on the back side, I can't see that I knocked any wiring during install but I'll definitely double check the wire your talking about, I've done pretty much everything besides change the pcm and wiring harness so it's worth a shot
01-06-2018, 08:17 PM
#24
CF Veteran
Wait a second.... you pulled out a bolt with a coolant passage. Are you talking about a cylinder head bolt? You shouldn't be pulling any of those after installation. Don't worry about a bolt being in coolant for the ground strap. It's the same as grounding it anywhere else on the cylinder head. You're still touching the metal, and that metal has coolant on the inside whether you're on that bolt or some other hole on the head. It's electrically the same point.
If you pulled out a single cylinder head bolt.... you're going to need to retorque it, to the spec. If it was in a coolant passage it's supposed to be thread locked with a proper sealant. I just used Red RTV and that's not what you're supposed to use, but we'll see how that holds up for me in the coming weeks. The manual says Loctite 592 thread sealant, or equivalent. And the thread needs to be completely dry as well as the bolt so coolant would need to be drained low to do it.
Who is Titan Performance Engines.... They aren't located in Ocala Florida are they...
If you pulled out a single cylinder head bolt.... you're going to need to retorque it, to the spec. If it was in a coolant passage it's supposed to be thread locked with a proper sealant. I just used Red RTV and that's not what you're supposed to use, but we'll see how that holds up for me in the coming weeks. The manual says Loctite 592 thread sealant, or equivalent. And the thread needs to be completely dry as well as the bolt so coolant would need to be drained low to do it.
Who is Titan Performance Engines.... They aren't located in Ocala Florida are they...
01-06-2018, 08:23 PM
#25
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Wait a second.... you pulled out a bolt with a coolant passage. Are you talking about a cylinder head bolt? You shouldn't be pulling any of those after installation. Don't worry about a bolt being in coolant for the ground strap. It's the same as grounding it anywhere else on the cylinder head. You're still touching the metal, and that metal has coolant on the inside whether you're on that bolt or some other hole on the head. It's electrically the same point.
If you pulled out a single cylinder head bolt.... you're going to need to retorque it, to the spec. If it was in a coolant passage it's supposed to be thread locked with a proper sealant. I just used Red RTV and that's not what you're supposed to use, but we'll see how that holds up for me in the coming weeks. The manual says Loctite 592 thread sealant, or equivalent. And the thread needs to be completely dry as well as the bolt so coolant would need to be drained low to do it.
Who is Titan Performance Engines.... They aren't located in Ocala Florida are they...
If you pulled out a single cylinder head bolt.... you're going to need to retorque it, to the spec. If it was in a coolant passage it's supposed to be thread locked with a proper sealant. I just used Red RTV and that's not what you're supposed to use, but we'll see how that holds up for me in the coming weeks. The manual says Loctite 592 thread sealant, or equivalent. And the thread needs to be completely dry as well as the bolt so coolant would need to be drained low to do it.
Who is Titan Performance Engines.... They aren't located in Ocala Florida are they...
01-06-2018, 08:33 PM
#26
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no it's not a head bolt, head bolts are not studded bolts like factory they are arp bolts, titan engines added apparently a coolant passage on the driver rear, yes I believe they are in florida. which would make sense for the ground being an issue possibly the cooling system wasn't fully burped which is why it ran fine before but now it could possible be interrupted by the coolant being present, I'll put a picture of the hole in talking about in a few
01-06-2018, 08:36 PM
#27
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Titan Engines are disreputable for strokers. I have had two failed from them, my first two. Then I built my own. They slap parts together to make sales from unsuspecting people. They are notorious in the stroker community. I think if you were on NAXJA you would find more about it. I recommend you avoid them like the plague. I didn't find out until after the fact myself and several people told me they bought failed strokers from those guys. I personally visited them since I lived an hour away in Florida. Standing in the front area I was behind someone that appeared to be a farmer and he wasn't happy about the engine he got. I didn't get all the details, but that was when I was there when I got it before I installed it, before I knew anything about them.
If you read the description on their web site about their cylinder head "they replace parts as needed". They take a head from a jeep, spiff it up, and turn around and sell it. The fact that they even take it apart to give it a valve job gives me the crawls. I've been around back to drop off parts and their service area is dirty AF. The guy I handed it off to had dirt grease and grim all over him. I've seen them first hand and I thought that was the norm for an engine builder. It's not, and it's not anything you want to do with when it comes to someone putting together an engine.
Be sure to add zinc to your oil every oil change, and I recommend you change it every 2,000 miles. Don't use FRAM oil filters, buy the best oil filters out there. Bleeping Jeep dissected them on his youtube channel and out of all of them the STP XL was the best. Many of the others weren't even half as good, to include names like Bosch and Mobil 1.
Did you break the cam and lifters in yourself with high ZDDP oil? Your electrical problems might be the least of your worries. What all did you get from Titan?
If you read the description on their web site about their cylinder head "they replace parts as needed". They take a head from a jeep, spiff it up, and turn around and sell it. The fact that they even take it apart to give it a valve job gives me the crawls. I've been around back to drop off parts and their service area is dirty AF. The guy I handed it off to had dirt grease and grim all over him. I've seen them first hand and I thought that was the norm for an engine builder. It's not, and it's not anything you want to do with when it comes to someone putting together an engine.
Be sure to add zinc to your oil every oil change, and I recommend you change it every 2,000 miles. Don't use FRAM oil filters, buy the best oil filters out there. Bleeping Jeep dissected them on his youtube channel and out of all of them the STP XL was the best. Many of the others weren't even half as good, to include names like Bosch and Mobil 1.
Did you break the cam and lifters in yourself with high ZDDP oil? Your electrical problems might be the least of your worries. What all did you get from Titan?
01-06-2018, 08:40 PM
#28
CF Veteran
There is a short stud with a square head that normally goes in there. That's what mine has. Looks like Titan dropped that on the dirty floor and forgot about it, probably next to a box of empty twinkies and a knocked over ashtray by another head they're getting ready.
Is that leaking coolant?
Is that leaking coolant?
01-06-2018, 08:42 PM
#29
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Titan Engines are disreputable for strokers. I have had two failed from them, my first two. Then I built my own. They slap parts together to make sales from unsuspecting people. They are notorious in the stroker community. I think if you were on NAXJA you would find more about it. I recommend you avoid them like the plague. I didn't find out until after the fact myself and several people told me they bought failed strokers from those guys. I personally visited them since I lived an hour away in Florida. Standing in the front area I was behind someone that appeared to be a farmer and he wasn't happy about the engine he got. I didn't get all the details, but that was when I was there when I got it before I installed it, before I knew anything about them.
If you read the description on their web site about their cylinder head "they replace parts as needed". They take a head from a jeep, spiff it up, and turn around and sell it. The fact that they even take it apart to give it a valve job gives me the crawls. I've been around back to drop off parts and their service area is dirty AF. The guy I handed it off to had dirt grease and grim all over him. I've seen them first hand and I thought that was the norm for an engine builder. It's not, and it's not anything you want to do with when it comes to someone putting together an engine.
Be sure to add zinc to your oil every oil change, and I recommend you change it every 2,000 miles. Don't use FRAM oil filters, buy the best oil filters out there. Bleeping Jeep dissected them on his youtube channel and out of all of them the STP XL was the best. Many of the others weren't even half as good, to include names like Bosch and Mobil 1.
Did you break the cam and lifters in yourself with high ZDDP oil? Your electrical problems might be the least of your worries. What all did you get from Titan?
If you read the description on their web site about their cylinder head "they replace parts as needed". They take a head from a jeep, spiff it up, and turn around and sell it. The fact that they even take it apart to give it a valve job gives me the crawls. I've been around back to drop off parts and their service area is dirty AF. The guy I handed it off to had dirt grease and grim all over him. I've seen them first hand and I thought that was the norm for an engine builder. It's not, and it's not anything you want to do with when it comes to someone putting together an engine.
Be sure to add zinc to your oil every oil change, and I recommend you change it every 2,000 miles. Don't use FRAM oil filters, buy the best oil filters out there. Bleeping Jeep dissected them on his youtube channel and out of all of them the STP XL was the best. Many of the others weren't even half as good, to include names like Bosch and Mobil 1.
Did you break the cam and lifters in yourself with high ZDDP oil? Your electrical problems might be the least of your worries. What all did you get from Titan?
01-06-2018, 08:44 PM
#30
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There is a short stud with a square head that normally goes in there. That's what mine has. Looks like Titan dropped that on the dirty floor and forgot about it, probably next to a box of empty twinkies and a knocked over ashtray by another head they're getting ready.
Is that leaking coolant?
Is that leaking coolant?