renix rough low idle
#1
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Year: 1988
Model: Cherokee
Engine: Renix 4.0
renix rough low idle
I know there has been a lot of other threads about rough idle but i've tried almost everything and nothing has helped. It's an 88 with 4.0 AW4 just hit 100,000 over the last 5,000 miles replaced, cap+rotor, plugs+wires, 02 sensor, tps all fluids and filters, pcv valve, vacuum harness cleaned throttle body and iac. It's seems to run worse when the engines cold and if i rev the engine and then let off it will almost stall, but if im giving it gas it will run perfect it's only rough at idle whether im in park, reverse, neutral or drive any help would be appreciated
ive also ran seafoam through it a few times
ive also ran seafoam through it a few times
#2
CF Veteran
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,004
Likes: 1
From: Wilmington,NC
Year: 1989
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
I know there has been a lot of other threads about rough idle but i've tried almost everything and nothing has helped. It's an 88 with 4.0 AW4 just hit 100,000 over the last 5,000 miles replaced, cap+rotor, plugs+wires, 02 sensor, tps all fluids and filters, pcv valve, vacuum harness cleaned throttle body and iac. It's seems to run worse when the engines cold and if i rev the engine and then let off it will almost stall, but if im giving it gas it will run perfect it's only rough at idle whether im in park, reverse, neutral or drive any help would be appreciated
ive also ran seafoam through it a few times
ive also ran seafoam through it a few times
#3
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 635
Likes: 2
From: Indiana
Year: 1999
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
Not sure what kind of i2 sensor you put in but try a Bosch one. For some reason my 89 hates the ntk but really likes the Bosch. With the ntk the computer goes crazy and won't go to closed loop, causing a bad idle. The Bosch fixed er right up. Just a thought! Also make sure the tps was set dead accurate since that can cause all sorts of issues. Also ground refreshing look up cruiser54's threads about it, it's major important.
#4
::CF Moderator::
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 43,971
Likes: 1,565
From: Prescott, Az
Year: 1990
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
Did you adjust the new TPS? And if so, how?
Make sure your intake manifold bolts are snug. They tend to loosen up over time.
Good advice on where to purchase the CPS, but they usually cause a "crank- no start".
Make sure your intake manifold bolts are snug. They tend to loosen up over time.
Good advice on where to purchase the CPS, but they usually cause a "crank- no start".
#5
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,874
Likes: 98
From: Northern Ontario, Canada
Year: 1990, 1999, 2000
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
try twisting the fuel injectors while the engine is running.
see if that changes the idle.
i would replace with sebring/cirrus 703 injectors.
see if that changes the idle.
i would replace with sebring/cirrus 703 injectors.
#6
CF Veteran
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,004
Likes: 1
From: Wilmington,NC
Year: 1989
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
Originally Posted by Guntar13
Not sure what kind of i2 sensor you put in but try a Bosch one. For some reason my 89 hates the ntk but really likes the Bosch. With the ntk the computer goes crazy and won't go to closed loop, causing a bad idle. The Bosch fixed er right up. Just a thought! Also make sure the tps was set dead accurate since that can cause all sorts of issues. Also ground refreshing look up cruiser54's threads about it, it's major important.
#7
CF Veteran
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,004
Likes: 1
From: Wilmington,NC
Year: 1989
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
Originally Posted by cruiser54
Did you adjust the new TPS? And if so, how?
Make sure your intake manifold bolts are snug. They tend to loosen up over time.
Good advice on where to purchase the CPS, but they usually cause a "crank- no start".
Make sure your intake manifold bolts are snug. They tend to loosen up over time.
Good advice on where to purchase the CPS, but they usually cause a "crank- no start".
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#8
::CF Moderator::
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 43,971
Likes: 1,565
From: Prescott, Az
Year: 1990
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
Like Guntar13 suggested, do the following. He speaks from experience.
Renix Ground Refreshing
The Renix era XJs and MJs were built with an under-engineered grounding system for the engine/transmission electronics. One problem in particular involves the multiple ground connection at the engine dipstick tube stud. A poor ground here can cause a multitude of driveabililty issues, wasted time, and wasted money replacing unnecessary components.
The components grounding at the dipstick tube stud are:
Distributor Sync Sensor, TCU main ground, TCU "Shift Point Logic", Ignition control Module, Injectors, ECU main ground which other engine sensors ground through, Oxygen sensor, Knock Sensor, Cruise Control, and Transmission Sync signal. All extremely important stuff.
The factory was aware of the issues with this ground point and addressed it by suggesting the following:
Remove the nut holding the wire terminals to the stud. Verify that the stud is indeed tightened securely into the block. Scrape any and all paint from the stud’s mounting surface where the wires will attach. Must be clean, shiny and free of any oil, grease, or paint.
Inspect the wire terminals. Check to see that none of the terminals are crimped over wire insulation instead of bare wire. Be sure the crimps are tight. It wouldn’t hurt to re-crimp them just as a matter of course. Sand and polish the wire terminals until clean and shiny on both sides. Reinstall all the wires to the stud and tighten the nut down securely.
While you’re in that general area, locate the battery negative cable which is fastened to the engine block just forward of the dipstick stud. Remove the bolt, scrape the block to bare metal, clean and polish the cable terminal, and reattach securely.
Another area where the grounding system on Renix era Jeeps was lacking is the engine to chassis ground. There is a braided cable from the back of the cylinder head that also attaches to the driver’s side of the firewall. This cable is undersized for it’s intended use and subject to corrosion and poor connections at each end.
First off, remove the cable end from the firewall using a 15mm wrench or socket. Scrape the paint off down to bare metal and clean the wire terminal. Reattach securely.
Remove the other end of the cable from the rear of the head using a 3’4" socket. Clean all the oil, paint and crud from the stud. Clean the wire terminal of the cable and reattach securely.
A suggestion regarding the braided cable:
I prefer to add a #4 Gauge cable from the firewall to a bolt on the rear of the intake manifold, either to a heat shield bolt or fuel rail bolt. A cable about 18" long with a 3/8" lug on each end works great and you can get one at any parts store already made up. Napa has them as part number 781116.
A further improvement to the grounding system can be made using a #4 cable, about 10" long with 3/8" terminals at each end. Attach one end of this cable to the negative battery bolt and the other end under the closest 10mm headed bolt on the radiator support just forward of the battery. Napa part number 781115.
If you want to upgrade your grounds and battery cables in general, contact Jon at www.kelleyswip.com. He makes an incredible cable upgrade for a very reasonable price.
Revised 11-28-2011
Renix Ground Refreshing
The Renix era XJs and MJs were built with an under-engineered grounding system for the engine/transmission electronics. One problem in particular involves the multiple ground connection at the engine dipstick tube stud. A poor ground here can cause a multitude of driveabililty issues, wasted time, and wasted money replacing unnecessary components.
The components grounding at the dipstick tube stud are:
Distributor Sync Sensor, TCU main ground, TCU "Shift Point Logic", Ignition control Module, Injectors, ECU main ground which other engine sensors ground through, Oxygen sensor, Knock Sensor, Cruise Control, and Transmission Sync signal. All extremely important stuff.
The factory was aware of the issues with this ground point and addressed it by suggesting the following:
Remove the nut holding the wire terminals to the stud. Verify that the stud is indeed tightened securely into the block. Scrape any and all paint from the stud’s mounting surface where the wires will attach. Must be clean, shiny and free of any oil, grease, or paint.
Inspect the wire terminals. Check to see that none of the terminals are crimped over wire insulation instead of bare wire. Be sure the crimps are tight. It wouldn’t hurt to re-crimp them just as a matter of course. Sand and polish the wire terminals until clean and shiny on both sides. Reinstall all the wires to the stud and tighten the nut down securely.
While you’re in that general area, locate the battery negative cable which is fastened to the engine block just forward of the dipstick stud. Remove the bolt, scrape the block to bare metal, clean and polish the cable terminal, and reattach securely.
Another area where the grounding system on Renix era Jeeps was lacking is the engine to chassis ground. There is a braided cable from the back of the cylinder head that also attaches to the driver’s side of the firewall. This cable is undersized for it’s intended use and subject to corrosion and poor connections at each end.
First off, remove the cable end from the firewall using a 15mm wrench or socket. Scrape the paint off down to bare metal and clean the wire terminal. Reattach securely.
Remove the other end of the cable from the rear of the head using a 3’4" socket. Clean all the oil, paint and crud from the stud. Clean the wire terminal of the cable and reattach securely.
A suggestion regarding the braided cable:
I prefer to add a #4 Gauge cable from the firewall to a bolt on the rear of the intake manifold, either to a heat shield bolt or fuel rail bolt. A cable about 18" long with a 3/8" lug on each end works great and you can get one at any parts store already made up. Napa has them as part number 781116.
A further improvement to the grounding system can be made using a #4 cable, about 10" long with 3/8" terminals at each end. Attach one end of this cable to the negative battery bolt and the other end under the closest 10mm headed bolt on the radiator support just forward of the battery. Napa part number 781115.
If you want to upgrade your grounds and battery cables in general, contact Jon at www.kelleyswip.com. He makes an incredible cable upgrade for a very reasonable price.
Revised 11-28-2011
#9
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Year: 1988
Model: Cherokee
Engine: Renix 4.0
i just tried twisting the fuel injectors while it was running and one of them sprayed out gas when i twisted it? I take it thats not suppose to happen. Also i forgot to mention that there has always been a slight hissing sound(possibly a vacuum leak) but i replaced and checked almost all my vacuum lines and that didn't help
#10
::CF Moderator::
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 43,971
Likes: 1,565
From: Prescott, Az
Year: 1990
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
i just tried twisting the fuel injectors while it was running and one of them sprayed out gas when i twisted it? I take it thats not suppose to happen. Also i forgot to mention that there has always been a slight hissing sound(possibly a vacuum leak) but i replaced and checked almost all my vacuum lines and that didn't help
#11
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Year: 1988
Model: Cherokee
Engine: Renix 4.0
I sprayed around the injectors and the same one that sprayed gas when I moved it whenever I sprayed around the injector with throttlebody cleaner the hissing sound wood go away. Could that be a bad o ring in injector ? Thanks for all the replies I'm finally getting somewhere
#12
CF Veteran
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,057
Likes: 2
From: Nazareth/Pen Argyl, Pennsylvania
Year: 1989
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0L 242ci I6
Mine just started doing this the other day too. I think it's my tps acting up again. I'll start it, it'll start fine and rev to about 1200, then rev down like usual, but go down to the first line on the tach and sputter. It stalled once or twice, but usually just idles low. I've noticed my exhaust got a little louder too on the deep tones if that helps any. But again, this all only happens sometimes. It still starts fine and it runs like a champ.
#13
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,874
Likes: 98
From: Northern Ontario, Canada
Year: 1990, 1999, 2000
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
i would pull and replace at least that one injector.
but in all reality, i would just pull all the stock injectors and replace with junkyard 703 injectors from a mid-late 90's chrysler cirrus/sebring.
be sure to replace at least the upper o-rings with new ones. just a few cents from autozone, etc.
be sure to lube up those o-rings with vaseline or similar before you slip on the fuel rail.
but in all reality, i would just pull all the stock injectors and replace with junkyard 703 injectors from a mid-late 90's chrysler cirrus/sebring.
be sure to replace at least the upper o-rings with new ones. just a few cents from autozone, etc.
be sure to lube up those o-rings with vaseline or similar before you slip on the fuel rail.
#15
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 43,971
Likes: 1,565
From: Prescott, Az
Year: 1990
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0