pineapple_tree

I’ve seen some of these threads before, but some were very old. So I wanted to make another thread because I have some questions

I’m smart enough to know that ethanol is very crappy and inefficient, and that even 10% ethanol is enough to goop up things, like what I found in my intake when I did my gasket for the intake and exhaust. Lots and lots of goopy black carbon, and not your typical solid carbon buildup, no. I could scrape it with a pick and clean it up down to the bare metal.

Anyway, if you use full ethanol gas, you end up getting less MPG vs how much you “save” by buying full ethanol gas, because you need a lot more ethanol to burn to gain the same amount of energy from burning straight gas. Not to mention it also burns hotter than gas, and it has a higher viscosity rating than gas, making it more “goopy” when it burns.

So i’ve been debating about running ethanol free gas through my little 4 banger, but i’m not very good with math. I don’t know if I would save anything in MPG vs how much I spend at the pump, because ethanol free gas is about .80 per gallon more expensive. So if gas is 3.29, ethanol free gas is 4.09. More than premium gas.

So to sum it all up…. Is it worth it to run ethanol free gas?

agreen

I did some testing on this and couple years ago. I ran 10 tanks of ethanol free vs 10 of E10. The mileage savings wasn't enough for me to keep buying it. It came close to breaking even, but the E10 still came out on top. I've also never had ethanol damage in any of my cars, to include the ones that are unfortunately carbureted.

pineapple_tree

If I ever run across ethanol free that’s cheaper than 4.09 a gallon, i’ll try some of it.

But as far as “damaging” anything, I don’t think that will happen unless you run e85 on something that’s not made for it, like our Jeeps. The only thing i’m concerned about is the buildup that I saw in my intake. I mean there was maybe half an inch of this black goo, and I’ve been meaning to take a fogger and fog my intake, and maybe clean out that gunk.

I even found that one of my injector holes had some gunk in it, and I cleaned that out, and it made my Jeep idle a little better.

agreen

That's not from ethanol. That's excessive blowby getting sucked in your intake by the PCV system.

Ultimate fix: rebuild or replace the engine.

Temporary patch: Pull the intake, clean the gunk out with some Easy Off oven cleaner, clean the intake valves with a toothbrush and some Berryman Chemtool, and reinstall the intake manifold with a catch can.

Cummins93

You can set up meth inj. That cleaned up my intake and exhaust nicely.

pineapple_tree

Thats weird. I’m not burning oil. 3k since my last oil change and it’s still right at max on the dipstick, just how it was when I put 4 quarts in. I did that to check how much oil I have after I fixed all my oil leaks, to see if I was burning oil.

To even further that, I pulled the plugs and they weren’t coated with oil. My old BMW coated them with oil even after 2k miles.

Now i’m not saying that it’s not burning oil, but I doubt it.

Is there a chance it’s something other than oil buildup? Because I know at one point the PO did the head gasket, but i’m not sure if he re-ringed it or rebuilt the entire motor.

agreen

If the head gasket got replaced, I wouldn't assume that the engine got new rings at all.

How many miles are on it? Does the oil get a gasoline smell to it when you do your oil changes?

It could just be residual crap leftover from the previous head gasket replacement. I'd go ahead and pull the manifold and clean that crap out, clean the backs of the valves a little, and maybe watch it to see what it does after the next couple of oil changes. If it continues to get buildup, you may have an engine problem. If not, then chalk it up to an incomplete head gasket job. Because as a tech, I'd have thrown that intake manifold in the parts washer as I cleaned up the head and block. I wouldn't allow a gunky intake leave my shop if I had the head off.

robsjeep

I stay away from the adulterated government mandated fuel. I prefer real gasoline. Better mileage, noncorrosive, non water absorbing, that is why I like gasoline. All my cars have steel tanks, most are carbed, but four have injection. Regular rubber seals don't last long, nor do original type hoses when exposed to adulterated fuel mandated in some areas. Then we got the lawnmower engine, seals dissolved when the adulterated mandated fuel was used. By the way the gas pump s by law put here have warnings on them, warming that the fuel may cause leaks in older cars, and hence a fire risk. Jeeze thanks for the warning, too bad the overlords dont allow the safe fuel. Where I live the subjects have no choice in the matter, I frickin hate the stuff, hate it. and its only $5/ gallon for regular out here too. And premium is only 91 Octane and about 25 cent more per gallon.

Meanwhile the electirc rates are skyrocketing as more folks plug in electric cars where I live. What a fun ride!

pineapple_tree

Yea, no doubt. I do the same things when I do jobs like a head gasket. And the gas smell, no. Not anymore. I had a bunch of ignition problems, and took care of those and that gas smell went away. That actually might be what that buildup is.

And as far as the actual job goes, I don’t know if the guy did it himself or a shop did it, and I have no idea what mileage it was done at. There aren’t many records of anything with this Jeep.

Regardless, I’ll take the intake off and clean it up and pull it back out later to see what it looks like.

And the engine has 290k on it, roughly. No idea if it’s been rebuilt, but the valve train and the bottom end of the engine looks suspiciously clean for 290k. Nice yellow color. Either it’s been taken care of, or rebuilt at some point

robsjeep

I stay away from the adulterated government mandated fuel. I prefer real gasoline. Better mileage, noncorrosive, non water absorbing, that is why I like gasoline. All my cars have steel tanks, most are carbed, but four have injection. Regular rubber seals don't last long, nor do original type hoses when exposed to adulterated fuel mandated in some areas. Then we got the lawnmower engine, seals dissolved when the adulterated mandated fuel was used. By the way the gas pump s by law put here have warnings on them, warming that the fuel may cause leaks in older cars, and hence a fire risk. Jeeze thanks for the warning, too bad the overlords dont allow the safe fuel. Where I live the subjects have no choice in the matter, I frickin hate the stuff, hate it. and its only $5/ gallon for regular out here too. And premium is only 91 Octane and about 25 cent more per gallon.

Meanwhile the electirc rates are skyrocketing as more folks plug in electric cars where I live. What a fun ride!

cruiser54

Everybody always makes a big deal about the "buildup" in the intake. It's perfectly normal. doesn't hurt a thing. Doesn't mean you're burning oil or have bad rings or any of that ****.

Mortgage Payer

If you do pay the extra for ethanol free, buy one of those cheap test kits from Amazon or eBay to see that you really are getting ethanol free.

doublechaz

Of all the cars I've owned or worked on for friends the overwhelming reason for oily gunk in the intake is not blow by and crush the car because it's done, but rather it's the PCV hasn't been replaced in a long time and is stuck open. $5 fix.

As to ethanol my 09 and 95 don't seem to mind, although I have not looked in the tank to see all the rust induced by the ethanol pulling moisture from the air and holding it in the tank. My 76 has experienced several hundred dollars in damage a little at a time, and again I have not looked inside the tank because it is made from 18 gauge unobtanium alloy and I would have to sell my house to afford a correct replacement. The junk fuel won't run the mower if I leave any in the tank between mowings so I've learned how much to fill it and then I just pin the deadman switch until it runs completely dry. YMMV.

awg

I have seen this debated so many times on vehicle forums, but moisture in tanks is caused by condensation, not ethanol, and will still be present in in any large vessel, the fact that water dissolves in ethanol means it gets taken out, rather than build up on the bottom of the tank and rust it out.

Having said that, I prefer ethanol free fuel

ethanol may effect old rubber, if its that old, its past its use by date anyway

agreen

If it's 1/2" of buildup, that's enough to actually be concerned with.

Yes, people do get wrapped up with "ethanol problems". It gets a bad reputation, but in the thousands of cars that I have worked on at dealerships and independent shops, I have never seen any problems caused by ethanol fuel. It's an easy scapegoat for a person's own neglect.