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Looking through the threads, i've seen quite a few posts about this potentially hazardous rust. I'm working through diagnosing how bad this is at this point. Passenger side windshield rails, Doesn't appear to leak - not incredibly brittle or soft - and glass still seems to be sealed. Any thoughts on how to address this in the short term so it doesn't get worse - and ultimately the best way to deal with it permanently so it doesn't threaten structural integrity? I'm new to fixing rust, curious where this issue might stand, on a scale 1-10 in severity. Thanks for any help - or links to pertinent threads!
My first thought is that does look pretty bad. Surprised it doesn't leak.
You should go right to the long term fix.
I can't imagine any short term fix that would work and buy you some time.
And IMO you are going to have to pull the windshield.
Thinking as bas as it looks to me it is even worse then you think.
Thinking about it a little more I realize I should have asked a question.
What are your plans for the Jeep? Just drive it till push comes to shove and get rid of it? Hope to keep it forever? LOL. Etc?
You say it doesn't leak. You pull the windshield you might open up a can worms.
I gotta buddy who always says "Anything can be fixed. As long as you are willing to pay for it".
So I guess you have to ask yourself what are you prepared to do.
This is kind of comparing apples to oranges but....
I got buddy who owns a '04 Taurus. Little wheel well rot. Like most of them do. He doesn't really care.
So about 4 years ago, maybe longer, I wire brushed all the loose stuff off and POR 15'ed it.
No cleaning or using the metal prep like the instructions say.
Well gotta tell you. We look at it from time to time and laugh.
Cause it is holding up way better then we thought it would.
My point is doing this as a short term solution till you get to the long term solution is probably not the best idea.
As I stated before go right to the long term solution.
Hey Ralph! Thanks for the reply. I'm going down the youtube/forum rust rabbit hole and trying to wrap my head around the order of operations here - so i appreciate you taking a moment to offer some feedback. I got the Jeep primarily to get up and down an old forest road to do some work up in the mountains once or twice a year - and maybe the odd camping trip or two - so i'm not looking for showroom quality here, however, i am hoping to get a few years of work out of it, and would love to feel safe inside. I've only hosed it off (hasn't rained since i've owned it in SO CAL) and didn't notice any leaks, but i'll do a bit more diligence to make sure that's truly the case.
I'm not a welder or fabricator - so the wire brush/POR 15 solution really sounds appealing, i'm not gonna lie - but your instinct to do it right the first time is probably what i need to be considering here.
Lets look at it this way.
Want to do it down and dirty. It lasts as long as it lasts. And don't care what it looks like.
Then I would gently wire brush off all the loose stuff. Not trying to create any holes finding out it is not as solid as you think.
Then brush on a couple coats of POR 15 and hope for the best.
Thinking the little starter kits would give you enough to do the job.
If were me I would not bother with the using the cleaner degreaser or the metal prep in there.
Now if you create a hole RTV the hell out of it. Maybe RTV around everything after the POR 15.
Now couple things. You want to try and get under the windshield molding too.
But just you know. That is not just purely cosmetic and sit on top of the windshield.
Thinking you have already realized this.
There is a channel in the molding that the windshield sits in.
My guess is when a windshield install is done that they gunk the channel on the Jeep.
And install the windshield already in the channel of the molding all in one shot.
My point is you want to try and not pull the molding off from around the windshield.
But you do want to try and POR 15 the rust under the molding best you can without doing that.
Which it looks like you might have done a little already looking at your third shot.
temporary measures will only allow more time for the rust to keep rusting, making problem worse. pull the glass and access the entire job. a media blasted will be the most effective way to remove the rust. painting over this with por 15 is recipe for disaster.
once it starts leaking, you may find water ruins the electric goodies under the dash, oh then it gets real fun, did I mention floor rust too when the window leaks?
if you dont pull the window for the fix, you might as well not even bother.
if you delay, the problem will get worse, perhaps to the point it is not reasonable to fix it.
silicone rtv can produce acid during the cure, avoid that, you dont need acid in the mix.
Thank you everyone who has responded so far. I've been reading up on pulling the windshield and what would be involved in doing that on my own in order to get a detailed look at the issue (and dreading it) - Hoping it isn't a disaster underneath is not the same as confirming it isn't a disaster underneath, so i think the 'do it right the first time' is the way to go about this.
Has anyone had any luck having a mobile glass outfit come out just to pop some glass out - do the proper repair work on their own - and then call the glass guy back to put it back in? I'd assume it's not cost effective or practical to do so, but i'd like to call around to see what my options are.
IYO: is Wire brush/grinder/sanding, Naval Jelly, POR 15, top coat - overkill, or an appropriate effort to stop this?
I got this truck expecting it would need some work - i shouldn't be surprised when it actually does XD
When I repaired my windscreen rust I had someone come out and remove the screen on the Friday and come back to fit a new screen on the Monday.
I reckon by the looks of it, if you get that glass removed, by the time you have cleaned off the remaining bonding glue and the flaky rust, you will have found a hole or 2. In your very first picture it actually looks like a hole just above the rubber trim.
I use a wire wheel to clean up rust but if the metal is weak, it will rip holes. My opinion is if the wire wheel can make a hole, the metal wanted replacing. A flap disk on a grinder may be a good option as it is abrasive but not overly like a grinding disk.
My screen surround was only rotten along the top and not down the sides. Your suggested approach is not overkill: Clean - Kill - Protect I would just expect repair to also be in there.
I have seen worse and I have seen worse repaired. It ain't easy or fun.
As far as I can tell, you have two choices here.
1
Say hell with it and run the Jeep into the ground. Not worrying one little bit and when it really starts going downhill you cut ties and get rid of it.
2
You get the windshield out, asses the damage, and repair properly.
this talk of wire wheeling and painting will not solve the problem. You might aswell just slobber caulking over the entire area and hope for the best.
Ok, you pull the glass, now is rust removal. I have been around the block on this very type of rust repair many times over the 40 years, good grief I seem old.
anyway rust removal...
1. Any repair that leaves rust is not good.
2... this sheet metal is thin when new, and paper thin or worse under the rust, thus do NOT use a grinding disc, sanding disc, flapper disc or simular on this, because those tools will remove good metal! and can locally heat the metal to warp it! Now hand sanding is fine start with corse 36 grit. a wire wheel can also get the bulk rust and paint removed, but tends to throw dirt every place. hand sanding and wire wheels as generally safe for use on thin metal.
you may elect to pay to have the area media blasted. be sure the blaster guy knows how to do body panels, the wrong media, wrong pressure, wrong technique can
vehemently warp a body panel! when done right, media blast removes all rust quickly
You wont know which is best, job it out to a blaster, or DIY depending on how bad it looks under the glass (It looks like it will be bad to me ) so Id start inquiring about a local blaster before pulling the glass, just in case.
a note on wire wheels, although quick at removing bulk loose rust and paint, this method tends to smear good steel and rust into a hard shinny darkish layer that will fool you into think the rust is gone. No, it is not gone, and that is where media blasting come in.
the problem is the deep tiny pits that rust forms, it is very hard for a wheel or sand paper to dig out the pits filled with rust. For small areas I have used a tungsten carbide scribe to pick out rust, but these are very small repairs, as this takes time.
So remember smeared polished rust from the wire wheel looks nice, dont be fooled by it and leave it there. This is CRITICAL!
3. if you got rust thru the metal, then you may have many pin holes, and thus rust on the reverse side of the metal also! you need to remove and paint it too, else the rust will reappear with a vengeance, maybe within a year, and all your work is ruined
4. A metal wash, or metal prep with phosphoric acid and zinc is recommended before primer. but make sure metal is oil free with an oil free no residue solvent and clean rags.
5. pin holes can be filled with epoxy such as jb weld. window seal surfaces should be smooth with no pits, if pitted seal area, then fill them. if there is lots of lost metal, then cut and weld for a restoration, else tricks with rivets and hand bent sheet metal bits with JB weld can be done in some cases and give a long lasting repair, not a restoration, but a functional repair that wont rust area right away again. If done in the window channel, it can be invisible when finished. but lets worry about that after we see what is left after rust removal.
6.. my primer of choice is a two part epoxy, DP primer is very good stuff, cures fast, and hard. you can brush it on the frame, it is very water proof.
rattle can paint is NOT to be used as a primer here, you need a good thick coat, and with all the rough pits, and the bends in the metal, a rattle can
spray pattern will be shadowed, so poor coverage on some surfaces, plus they dont make DP in rattle cans
prime the backside too if there was any rust thru. DP primer is very water proof and as such does not need to be top coated
after primer cures, then you may have some rattle can for the top color coat over the primer.
Also select the correct color primer for top coat. silver top coat should get a white or very light grey primer, a black top coat should use a dark primer, black,or dark red are common for that. DP comes in different colors for this reason. putting a white topcoat over dark red primer is bad policy, you will need extra top coats to cover fully
make sure the paint cures fully before window install, make sure paint is not nicked during install. for those with metal trim, make sure it fits, that all the clips are in place, and new glass is properly centered in the frame. If any of these are off, then the metal window trim will hit the body, a d nick the new paint, hidden under the trim the nick will get wet, and it will rust away, you wont notice it till the paint bubbles up an inch away in a year or two!
7. Oh yeah, for sanding stage, mask the heck out of the window opening, tape over the defroast vents too, dust will get everyplace other wise.
DP primer or simular products can got at a local autobody supply store. my local Napa Autoparts also seals autobody shop supplies and will even mix paint to a paint chip or code and put it a rattle can for you for the top coat!
I did something similar to an MGA Coupe many years ago. It's a bit of a pain but it's a good way. I've used stretchers and shrinkers and didn't like the results. Fabricating individual pieces and welding them together as shown here by Fitzee is much easier. Still a lot of work though.
One more thing, before a rust repair, assess the entire truck for other damage. if that truck has other rusty window frames, rusty floors, rockers, suspension mounts etc... then it may not be worth fixing the windshield frame rust. put a grand into the windshield repair, another grand for the rockers, another for the floors and soon the repairs are worth more than the jeep.
it will be a very rare case to have the huge amount of windshield frame rust you got, without having a lot of other serious rust, be it exposed or lurking.
it might be better to buy another truck with better body. dont toss money on this repair only to find you need five times more repair on other areas. you dont want the repairs to cost more than the truck. it is not like this is some rare ferrari. xj's are still common and cheap.
07-16-2021, 12:18 AM
Windshield Frame Rust - '00 XJ Sport 4.0
