made to pay for services not recieved
02-04-2014 | 02:57 AM
#31
Seasoned Member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 448
Likes: 0
From: Sucka Free East Bay Cali
Year: 2000
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
its not the shops failure.. its the vehicles failure that prevented them from performing the work.. they tried!
If you asked me to replace your brake pads... and I started pulling off your tires and calipers.. and found out that your caliper was seized and that is what burned up your brake pads.. and informed you that the caliper was seized.. and it would cost a little extra to replace the caliper... but you didnt have the extra money... so i put it all back together for you because you couldn't afford the proper repair.. I would hand you back your parts.. and tell you that you owe me a half hour of labor only.. is that not fair?
You didnt ask me to diagnose WHY your brakes failed.. you just asked me to replace the pads and handed me the pads...
Its not MY FAULT that i couldnt finish the job.. its your fault for not being able to afford the FULL repair..
I should still be paid for the labor that I DID DO!
If you asked me to replace your brake pads... and I started pulling off your tires and calipers.. and found out that your caliper was seized and that is what burned up your brake pads.. and informed you that the caliper was seized.. and it would cost a little extra to replace the caliper... but you didnt have the extra money... so i put it all back together for you because you couldn't afford the proper repair.. I would hand you back your parts.. and tell you that you owe me a half hour of labor only.. is that not fair?
You didnt ask me to diagnose WHY your brakes failed.. you just asked me to replace the pads and handed me the pads...
Its not MY FAULT that i couldnt finish the job.. its your fault for not being able to afford the FULL repair..
I should still be paid for the labor that I DID DO!
02-04-2014 | 03:00 AM
#32
CF Veteran
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,314
Likes: 3
From: Canton, GA
Year: 1996
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
02-04-2014 | 03:07 AM
#33
Seasoned Member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 448
Likes: 0
From: Sucka Free East Bay Cali
Year: 2000
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
Had a very bad experience at the dealership today. I had purchased 2 key fobs for my Cherokee as the originals were lost. After waiting about 20 minutes, I was told my module wouldn't communicate and they couldn't program the fobs. Then they wanted the full price anyway! Even though they didn't complete the job!
I will not mention the names or dealership pending a complaint call I have into Chrysler.
I will not mention the names or dealership pending a complaint call I have into Chrysler.
02-04-2014 | 03:15 AM
#34
::Regional Moderator::
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,912
Likes: 6
From: Over here...
Year: 1986
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 2.8
My shop teacher told us this story when we were in school.
A very important machine stops working at a business, so the owner calls in a repairman. When the repairman shows up, they tell him what's wrong with the machine. The repairman looks it over for a second, pulls out a hammer from his toolbox, and taps the machine with it. The machine starts working again. He tells the owner he'll mail him a bill. A few days later the bill shows up in the owners mailbox. He opens it and is shocked to see that the bill is $100. He calls up the repairman, furious to be charged such a large sum of money for only a few minutes of the his time. He demands the repairman sends him an itemized list before he'll even consider to pay the bill. A few more days pass and another envelope is delivered to the business owner. He rips it open and finds the attached itemized list.
1) $1 for labor
2) $99 for knowing where to hit machine with hammer
Knowledge in a business setting isn't free. It's not a forum with a bunch of people helping each other, it's a business. When I was a dealer tech our scan tool cost $10k. My friends shop just bought a $12k scan tool. This isn't Auto Zone where they're using a $100 code puller. You have cost of tools/equipment, cost of mechanics/service writers, ASE renewal costs, continued training workshop costs, costs involved with running the business (electric, gas, water, shop supplies, insurance) and so on.
A very important machine stops working at a business, so the owner calls in a repairman. When the repairman shows up, they tell him what's wrong with the machine. The repairman looks it over for a second, pulls out a hammer from his toolbox, and taps the machine with it. The machine starts working again. He tells the owner he'll mail him a bill. A few days later the bill shows up in the owners mailbox. He opens it and is shocked to see that the bill is $100. He calls up the repairman, furious to be charged such a large sum of money for only a few minutes of the his time. He demands the repairman sends him an itemized list before he'll even consider to pay the bill. A few more days pass and another envelope is delivered to the business owner. He rips it open and finds the attached itemized list.
1) $1 for labor
2) $99 for knowing where to hit machine with hammer
Knowledge in a business setting isn't free. It's not a forum with a bunch of people helping each other, it's a business. When I was a dealer tech our scan tool cost $10k. My friends shop just bought a $12k scan tool. This isn't Auto Zone where they're using a $100 code puller. You have cost of tools/equipment, cost of mechanics/service writers, ASE renewal costs, continued training workshop costs, costs involved with running the business (electric, gas, water, shop supplies, insurance) and so on.
02-04-2014 | 03:20 AM
#35
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 0
From: Texas
Random Customer: Can you replace my brakes?
Random Customer: Can you program my key fob?
---------------------------------------------------
Random Shop: SURE! Do you have the parts?
Random Customer: I sure do! (hands over the parts)
Random Shop: Great! Let me get it in the back and get started for you!
Random Customer: Okey dokey!
(as we can see... as of right now.. the situation is the exact same! lets continue on!)
20 minutes later....
Random Shop to Key fob guy: Sir... we spent 20 minutes trying to program your FOB... seems there is a problem with getting your vehicle to communicate... This is not normal and beyond our control.. We could look into this further and get you all fixed up... Or just charge you a half hour of labor for what we DID do... Bobby the starving mechanic tried 3 times to get the fobs to work... because he is a devoted mechanic and has 3 kids to feed.. He says he thinks he can repair it... but it would cost you extra.. What would you like to do?
Random Shop to brake pad man: Sir... we got your vehicle tore apart.. and found out the caliper is seized horribly... in fact its the worst caliper that we have ever seen... This was by no means expected.. bobby the starving mechanic with 3 kids can get it all fixed up for you.. but it would cost you extra to have the caliper replaced.. would you like us to go ahead and do that for you?
Random Customers response: No thank you... I don't have the extra money to do the extra work needed to fix the vehicle in order for you to finish repairing my original request. I understand that it isn't your fault that something with MY vehicle was behind you not being able to finish my repairs. I will gladly pay you the half hour of labor for giving it a shot... and I will return as soon as i get the money together to have the repair completed properly.
Random shops: (returns customers vehicle the same as it rolled in.. but with 30 minutes of their time invested... and PAID FOR!
02-04-2014 | 03:25 AM
#37
CF Veteran
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,314
Likes: 3
From: Canton, GA
Year: 1996
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
My shop teacher told us this story when we were in school.
A very important machine stops working at a business, so the owner calls in a repairman. When the repairman shows up, they tell him what's wrong with the machine. The repairman looks it over for a second, pulls out a hammer from his toolbox, and taps the machine with it. The machine starts working again. He tells the owner he'll mail him a bill. A few days later the bill shows up in the owners mailbox. He opens it and is shocked to see that the bill is $100. He calls up the repairman, furious to be charged such a large sum of money for only a few minutes of the his time. He demands the repairman sends him an itemized list before he'll even consider to pay the bill. A few more days pass and another envelope is delivered to the business owner. He rips it open and finds the attached itemized list.
1) $1 for labor
2) $99 for knowing where to hit machine with hammer
Knowledge in a business setting isn't free. It's not a forum with a bunch of people helping each other, it's a business. When I was a dealer tech our scan tool cost $10k. My friends shop just bought a $12k scan tool. This isn't Auto Zone where they're using a $100 code puller. You have cost of tools/equipment, cost of mechanics/service writers, ASE renewal costs, continued training workshop costs, costs involved with running the business (electric, gas, water, shop supplies, insurance) and so on.
A very important machine stops working at a business, so the owner calls in a repairman. When the repairman shows up, they tell him what's wrong with the machine. The repairman looks it over for a second, pulls out a hammer from his toolbox, and taps the machine with it. The machine starts working again. He tells the owner he'll mail him a bill. A few days later the bill shows up in the owners mailbox. He opens it and is shocked to see that the bill is $100. He calls up the repairman, furious to be charged such a large sum of money for only a few minutes of the his time. He demands the repairman sends him an itemized list before he'll even consider to pay the bill. A few more days pass and another envelope is delivered to the business owner. He rips it open and finds the attached itemized list.
1) $1 for labor
2) $99 for knowing where to hit machine with hammer
Knowledge in a business setting isn't free. It's not a forum with a bunch of people helping each other, it's a business. When I was a dealer tech our scan tool cost $10k. My friends shop just bought a $12k scan tool. This isn't Auto Zone where they're using a $100 code puller. You have cost of tools/equipment, cost of mechanics/service writers, ASE renewal costs, continued training workshop costs, costs involved with running the business (electric, gas, water, shop supplies, insurance) and so on.
Again, something for nothing.... Time is money.
02-04-2014 | 03:27 AM
#38
Seasoned Member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 448
Likes: 0
From: Sucka Free East Bay Cali
Year: 2000
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
My comparison had the exact same situation.. apples to apples!
Random Customer: Can you replace my brakes?
Random Customer: Can you program my key fob?
---------------------------------------------------
Random Shop: SURE! Do you have the parts?
Random Customer: I sure do! (hands over the parts)
Random Shop: Great! Let me get it in the back and get started for you!
Random Customer: Okey dokey!
(as we can see... as of right now.. the situation is the exact same! lets continue on!)
20 minutes later....
Random Shop to Key fob guy: Sir... we spent 20 minutes trying to program your FOB... seems there is a problem with getting your vehicle to communicate... This is not normal and beyond our control.. We could look into this further and get you all fixed up... Or just charge you a half hour of labor for what we DID do... Bobby the starving mechanic tried 3 times to get the fobs to work... because he is a devoted mechanic and has 3 kids to feed.. He says he thinks he can repair it... but it would cost you extra.. What would you like to do?
Random Shop to brake pad man: Sir... we got your vehicle tore apart.. and found out the caliper is seized horribly... in fact its the worst caliper that we have ever seen... This was by no means expected.. bobby the starving mechanic with 3 kids can get it all fixed up for you.. but it would cost you extra to have the caliper replaced.. would you like us to go ahead and do that for you?
Random Customers response: No thank you... I don't have the extra money to do the extra work needed to fix the vehicle in order for you to finish repairing my original request. I understand that it isn't your fault that something with MY vehicle was behind you not being able to finish my repairs. I will gladly pay you the half hour of labor for giving it a shot... and I will return as soon as i get the money together to have the repair completed properly.
Random shops: (returns customers vehicle the same as it rolled in.. but with 30 minutes of their time invested... and PAID FOR!
Random Customer: Can you replace my brakes?
Random Customer: Can you program my key fob?
---------------------------------------------------
Random Shop: SURE! Do you have the parts?
Random Customer: I sure do! (hands over the parts)
Random Shop: Great! Let me get it in the back and get started for you!
Random Customer: Okey dokey!
(as we can see... as of right now.. the situation is the exact same! lets continue on!)
20 minutes later....
Random Shop to Key fob guy: Sir... we spent 20 minutes trying to program your FOB... seems there is a problem with getting your vehicle to communicate... This is not normal and beyond our control.. We could look into this further and get you all fixed up... Or just charge you a half hour of labor for what we DID do... Bobby the starving mechanic tried 3 times to get the fobs to work... because he is a devoted mechanic and has 3 kids to feed.. He says he thinks he can repair it... but it would cost you extra.. What would you like to do?
Random Shop to brake pad man: Sir... we got your vehicle tore apart.. and found out the caliper is seized horribly... in fact its the worst caliper that we have ever seen... This was by no means expected.. bobby the starving mechanic with 3 kids can get it all fixed up for you.. but it would cost you extra to have the caliper replaced.. would you like us to go ahead and do that for you?
Random Customers response: No thank you... I don't have the extra money to do the extra work needed to fix the vehicle in order for you to finish repairing my original request. I understand that it isn't your fault that something with MY vehicle was behind you not being able to finish my repairs. I will gladly pay you the half hour of labor for giving it a shot... and I will return as soon as i get the money together to have the repair completed properly.
Random shops: (returns customers vehicle the same as it rolled in.. but with 30 minutes of their time invested... and PAID FOR!
02-04-2014 | 03:29 AM
#39
CF Veteran
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,314
Likes: 3
From: Canton, GA
Year: 1996
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
02-04-2014 | 03:32 AM
#41
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 0
From: Texas
im not sure how i can make this any more clear for you man?
if you asked a shop to replace your spark plugs because of a missfire, and after performing the work.. the missfire was still there... would you not want to pay them?
if you asked a shop to replace your spark plugs because of a missfire, and after performing the work.. the missfire was still there... would you not want to pay them?
02-04-2014 | 03:33 AM
#42
CF Veteran
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,314
Likes: 3
From: Canton, GA
Year: 1996
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
02-04-2014 | 03:35 AM
#44
::Regional Moderator::
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,912
Likes: 6
From: Over here...
Year: 1986
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 2.8
I've seen shops lose money on certain jobs. It's not unheard of that a shop under quotes a job or they run into a vehicle that requires a special scan tool (you run into this problem with big trucks). The shops themselves pay for the other shop/dealer to do the work and often do not charge the customer the additional fees. Sometimes you learn hard lessons in this business.
02-04-2014 | 03:38 AM
#45
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 0
From: Texas
I've seen shops lose money on certain jobs. It's not unheard of that a shop under quotes a job or they run into a vehicle that requires a special scan tool (you run into this problem with big trucks). The shops themselves pay for the other shop/dealer to do the work and often do not charge the customer the additional fees. Sometimes you learn hard lessons in this business.